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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:57 pm 
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Windy1970 wrote:
I agree, but my main concern is what will be the F.A.’s timescale in creating this new step 4 league! The F.A. wants to create a 1-2-4-8-16 pyramid. So step 5 will be facing a major overhaul & two new leagues created. With the creation of this step 4 league, the F.A. will need to find a total of 60 extra clubs for these new leagues. Are the F.A. going to wait for this two year pilot scheme to end, before the next restructure? Will they link the creation of the two new step 5 leagues, to the new step 4 league? Are we looking at the minimum timescale of season 2020/21 or beyond? How many clubs will potentially fold or be put under financial pressure, because the F.A. won’t rush any further changes that benefit the northeast!


Can't argue with any of that - I'm in favour of our league being an active participant in the pyramid, but have concerns that as planned, you are asking our clubs to jump from travelling to North Yorkshire, to Leicester area!

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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 1:37 pm 
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Terrierdave wrote:
Windy1970 wrote:
I agree, but my main concern is what will be the F.A.’s timescale in creating this new step 4 league! The F.A. wants to create a 1-2-4-8-16 pyramid. So step 5 will be facing a major overhaul & two new leagues created. With the creation of this step 4 league, the F.A. will need to find a total of 60 extra clubs for these new leagues. Are the F.A. going to wait for this two year pilot scheme to end, before the next restructure? Will they link the creation of the two new step 5 leagues, to the new step 4 league? Are we looking at the minimum timescale of season 2020/21 or beyond? How many clubs will potentially fold or be put under financial pressure, because the F.A. won’t rush any further changes that benefit the northeast!


Can't argue with any of that - I'm in favour of our league being an active participant in the pyramid, but have concerns that as planned, you are asking our clubs to jump from travelling to North Yorkshire, to Leicester area!


Unfortunately Dave that’s a situation that has developed by the NLs own doing and they are now looking for support


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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:02 pm 
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Yes, which will understandably be thin on the ground outside of this region.

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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:04 pm 
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england wrote:
Terrierdave wrote:
Windy1970 wrote:
I agree, but my main concern is what will be the F.A.’s timescale in creating this new step 4 league! The F.A. wants to create a 1-2-4-8-16 pyramid. So step 5 will be facing a major overhaul & two new leagues created. With the creation of this step 4 league, the F.A. will need to find a total of 60 extra clubs for these new leagues. Are the F.A. going to wait for this two year pilot scheme to end, before the next restructure? Will they link the creation of the two new step 5 leagues, to the new step 4 league? Are we looking at the minimum timescale of season 2020/21 or beyond? How many clubs will potentially fold or be put under financial pressure, because the F.A. won’t rush any further changes that benefit the northeast!


Can't argue with any of that - I'm in favour of our league being an active participant in the pyramid, but have concerns that as planned, you are asking our clubs to jump from travelling to North Yorkshire, to Leicester area!


Unfortunately Dave that’s a situation that has developed by the NLs own doing and they are now looking for support


The 3 Isthmian step 4 League footprints are tiny, compared to the two NPL & the SLPS&W! Compulsory promotion isn’t going to just effect the northeast, it’ll be just as bad for the southwest! The sooner the F.A. actually deals with these problems the better.


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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:06 pm 
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Terrierdave wrote:
Windy1970 wrote:
I agree, but my main concern is what will be the F.A.’s timescale in creating this new step 4 league! The F.A. wants to create a 1-2-4-8-16 pyramid. So step 5 will be facing a major overhaul & two new leagues created. With the creation of this step 4 league, the F.A. will need to find a total of 60 extra clubs for these new leagues. Are the F.A. going to wait for this two year pilot scheme to end, before the next restructure? Will they link the creation of the two new step 5 leagues, to the new step 4 league? Are we looking at the minimum timescale of season 2020/21 or beyond? How many clubs will potentially fold or be put under financial pressure, because the F.A. won’t rush any further changes that benefit the northeast!


Can't argue with any of that - I'm in favour of our league being an active participant in the pyramid, but have concerns that as planned, you are asking our clubs to jump from travelling to North Yorkshire, to Leicester area!


Slight side issue, but did you agree with your Club winning the League 5 times and not taking promotion Dave ? Arguably they have contributed to this situation, although not doing anything wrong at the time

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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:37 pm 
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I only moved to Bedlington part way through that run of success, and so can't claim a great insight at that point, although I did get involved as time went on. I think it was a missed opportunity, but also viewing the administration of the club in that period, I'm not convinced the club would have survived. But then we've nearly gone under twice since then so who knows.

And after all, look at us now...

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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:42 pm 
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Windy1970 wrote:
england wrote:
The 3 Isthmian step 4 League footprints are tiny, compared to the two NPL & the SLPS&W! Compulsory promotion isn’t going to just effect the northeast, it’ll be just as bad for the southwest! The sooner the F.A. actually deals with these problems the better.


True, but you have to take into consideration the concentration of England's population in the geographical area. It's inevitable that the larger number of clubs are going to mean a smaller footprint. In the NPL (and South West) area, there is a lot of empty space and fewer, smaller populated urban areas. The pyramid is never going to be perfect because of this, but it can be better.

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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:53 pm 
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Terrierdave wrote:
Windy1970 wrote:
england wrote:
The 3 Isthmian step 4 League footprints are tiny, compared to the two NPL & the SLPS&W! Compulsory promotion isn’t going to just effect the northeast, it’ll be just as bad for the southwest! The sooner the F.A. actually deals with these problems the better.


True, but you have to take into consideration the concentration of England's population in the geographical area. It's inevitable that the larger number of clubs are going to mean a smaller footprint. In the NPL (and South West) area, there is a lot of empty space and fewer, smaller populated urban areas. The pyramid is never going to be perfect because of this, but it can be better.


Nick Robinson from the F.A. is also a senior Isthmian League committee member. Has been behind the restructuring, especially since Mike Appleby has been retired off. So this restructuring has totally benefited the southeast & it makes you wonder why :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:55 pm 
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The 3 Isthmian step 4 League footprints are tiny, compared to the two NPL & the SLPS&W! Compulsory promotion isn’t going to just effect the northeast, it’ll be just as bad for the southwest! The sooner the F.A. actually deals with these problems the better.[/quote]

They may be tiny in terms of geography but not in the density of numbers of clubs and players, and the number of feeder leagues approximately into each step 4 equates. Holbeach won't delighted either to have to go into the NPL but then the FA haven't much choice if NL teams haven't joined over the years. Is it 27 seasons, or is it 26 since the NL became part of the pyramid. Either way only 6 teams have gone up into the NPL, and one of them didn't go up as champions.


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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 3:29 pm 
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Not delighted with the Isthmian having 3 leagues under their control, will it be Isthmian North, Isthmian Central and Isthmian South and East etc?

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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 3:33 pm 
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aidan's father wrote:
The 3 Isthmian step 4 League footprints are tiny, compared to the two NPL & the SLPS&W! Compulsory promotion isn’t going to just effect the northeast, it’ll be just as bad for the southwest! The sooner the F.A. actually deals with these problems the better.


They may be tiny in terms of geography but not in the density of numbers of clubs and players, and the number of feeder leagues approximately into each step 4 equates. Holbeach won't delighted either to have to go into the NPL but then the FA haven't much choice if NL teams haven't joined over the years. Is it 27 seasons, or is it 26 since the NL became part of the pyramid. Either way only 6 teams have gone up into the NPL, and one of them didn't go up as champions.[/quote]

The density of clubs is a red herring in my opinion. Some of the step 6 leagues in the southeast are barely sustainable. Yet there are always numerous clubs from the north & midlands step 7 feeder leagues, applying for promotion to step 6. Just look at the amount of clubs applying for promotion to the new regionalised NWCL’s. The main reason they haven’t in the past, is because the NWCL is too large a footprint. Stretching from Oswestry to Carlisle! I agree with Mike Amos, when he said the F.A. should have started at the grassroots(step 7)& then worked upwards. If the pyramid was structured correctly all those years ago, would NL teams applied for & accepted promotion?


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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 3:38 pm 
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Terrierdave wrote:
I only moved to Bedlington part way through that run of success, and so can't claim a great insight at that point, although I did get involved as time went on. I think it was a missed opportunity, but also viewing the administration of the club in that period, I'm not convinced the club would have survived. But then we've nearly gone under twice since then so who knows.

And after all, look at us now...


Great point and well answered Dave. It’s a great case study which massively counter acts the argument about clubs taking promotion and going to the wall. What about a club like bedlington who haven’t taken promotion and have almost went to the wall and are in comparison struggling now.


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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 3:41 pm 
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goose wrote:
Not delighted with the Isthmian having 3 leagues under their control, will it be Isthmian North, Isthmian Central and Isthmian South and East etc?


I think it’s the North, South & West! Allegedly one of those leagues will not be part of the Isthmian League after the pilot scheme has finished. We’ll see if this actually happens though. Because the Isthmian League is only gaining the clubs it lost before the previous big restructuring. It gained, East Anglia, Kent & Sussex from the SLP & lost the West of London clubs. So empire building comes to mind!!


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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 3:45 pm 
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They always seem to kick up a fuss, seem to remember them haggling over relegation places at the last restructure.

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 Post subject: Re: The FA's proposed new restructuring
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:04 pm 
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goose wrote:
They always seem to kick up a fuss, seem to remember them haggling over relegation places at the last restructure.


One of the biggest reasons why the southeast is so oversubscribed with clubs. Is because, the original Isthmian League had 4 divisions(Prem, One, Two & Three). The whole of Div 2 were promoted & merged with Div 1, to become Div1 North & South! Div 3 was promoted to become Div 2 & became a step 7 league(before the league was disbanded & the teams placed in other leagues). So you can see that the teams in that league have had mass promotions & this effected the whole pyramid. Causing it to have a southeastern drift. That’s why the F.A. wants to even out promotion this time. Unless the F.A. mass promotes in all the other regions next time. We’ll be stuck with large footprints in the southwest, midlands & the north of the country!


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